Batman & Robin

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Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:12 am

Discussion and Reviews
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:05 am

Just finished up #21 and I really enjoyed it. Tomasi and Gleason are a dynamic duo of their own right when it comes to writer/artist collaboration and this book is just better for them being together on this book. The interactions between Alfred, Dick and Damian are awesome. I love how DIck looks pleased at how Damian is learning to be a better detective and when Alfred compliments him on that fact, Damian is just like, "Yeah. I know I'm good."

I also love how Dick is portrayed here as a really good detective in his own right. He notices stuff and he's really observant. I loved the little scene where Dick is mentioning something to Damian and he replies about how interesting it was and can't wait to tweet it. The dialogue is very sharp and witty and I am enjoying this dynamic duo a whole lot.

The M.O. of this white knight is fantastic. I am sure this has probably been done before but I don't care. It's still very awesome and I can't wait to find out who this White Knight actually is. The art is fantastic and that one page with Batman and Robin swinging over the city with the Bat-Signal is absolutely gorgeous. Love this book and can't wait for the conclusion of this story.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Debaser77 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:43 am

Here's my review of both Batman and Robin #21 and Batman Incorporated #3 on the main site.

http://panelsonpages.com/?p=35928
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:00 pm

Nicely written review.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby D-Rock » Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:58 pm

jaydee74 wrote:Just finished up #21 and I really enjoyed it. Tomasi and Gleason are a dynamic duo of their own right when it comes to writer/artist collaboration and this book is just better for them being together on this book. The interactions between Alfred, Dick and Damian are awesome. I love how DIck looks pleased at how Damian is learning to be a better detective and when Alfred compliments him on that fact, Damian is just like, "Yeah. I know I'm good."

I also love how Dick is portrayed here as a really good detective in his own right. He notices stuff and he's really observant. I loved the little scene where Dick is mentioning something to Damian and he replies about how interesting it was and can't wait to tweet it. The dialogue is very sharp and witty and I am enjoying this dynamic duo a whole lot.

The M.O. of this white knight is fantastic. I am sure this has probably been done before but I don't care. It's still very awesome and I can't wait to find out who this White Knight actually is.


Agreed with everything here. Another well done issue and I'm really looking forward to seeing how this villain plays out.

The art is fantastic and that one page with Batman and Robin swinging over the city with the Bat-Signal is absolutely gorgeous.


Couldn't agree more. When I flipped the page to that one I actually paused to stare and literally said "Wow".
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 6:05 pm

I have stared at that page on and off for some time now. It's absolutely amazing. Love it.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:59 pm

Batman & Robin

Now this is what I'm talking about. This is exactly what I want in a Batman book. I haven't been the happiest person about Dick being Batman (I love him as Nightwing), but with Tomasi writing I just don't care. He nails Dick perfectly.

There are so many great touches in this book. I love Dick being a good detective, and Damian's skills improving. I don't know if it was intentional, but I loved how Dick took off the cape and cowl when back at base. I don't know why, but it just felt like something Dick would do.

The art is flat out gorgeous. I find myself just staring at pages. Gleason is doing great work.

I really hope Tomasi and Gleason are on this book for a good long time.

-----------------------

I have a question. On the letters page someone asked if Bruce was actually Damian's father. They said to look at Batman #676 for answers. I read that, but I can't remember exactly what went down (and with it being Morrison who wrote that odds are I never knew what happened :lol:). Is there any doubt about whether Bruce is his father? I really hope not, I've really come to love Damian, and I like that he's Bruce's son.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby D-Rock » Sun Mar 13, 2011 12:39 am

Batman25JM wrote:I have a question. On the letters page someone asked if Bruce was actually Damian's father. They said to look at Batman #676 for answers. I read that, but I can't remember exactly what went down (and with it being Morrison who wrote that odds are I never knew what happened :lol:). Is there any doubt about whether Bruce is his father? I really hope not, I've really come to love Damian, and I like that he's Bruce's son.


In that issue, Tim asks Alfred if Bruce ran a paternity test on Damian. Alfred confirmed that he did, but didn't want to tell Tim the results until "the time was right". Tim responds with "the son of the Devil is my brother", but Alfred neither confirms or denies it.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Sun Mar 13, 2011 12:46 am

D-Rock wrote:
Batman25JM wrote:I have a question. On the letters page someone asked if Bruce was actually Damian's father. They said to look at Batman #676 for answers. I read that, but I can't remember exactly what went down (and with it being Morrison who wrote that odds are I never knew what happened :lol:). Is there any doubt about whether Bruce is his father? I really hope not, I've really come to love Damian, and I like that he's Bruce's son.


In that issue, Tim asks Alfred if Bruce ran a paternity test on Damian. Alfred confirmed that he did, but didn't want to tell Tim the results until "the time was right". Tim responds with "the son of the Devil is my brother", but Alfred neither confirms or denies it.



Okay. Thanks.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:24 pm

Batman25JM wrote:Batman & Robin
Now this is what I'm talking about. This is exactly what I want in a Batman book. I haven't been the happiest person about Dick being Batman (I love him as Nightwing), but with Tomasi writing I just don't care. He nails Dick perfectly.

PoP quote of the year? ;)
Batman25JM wrote:[u]Batman & Robin
There are so many great touches in this book. I love Dick being a good detective, and Damian's skills improving. I don't know if it was intentional, but I loved how Dick took off the cape and cowl when back at base. I don't know why, but it just felt like something Dick would do.

I think the touches in the interaction between Dick and Damian are simply outstanding. They have a good back and forth going on and I agree. Dick would take off the cape and cowl in the cave and you noticed that Damian kept it on? I liked tht.
Batman25JM wrote:[u]Batman & Robin
The art is flat out gorgeous. I find myself just staring at pages. Gleason is doing great work.

Love the art.
Batman25JM wrote:[u]Batman & Robin
I really hope Tomasi and Gleason are on this book for a good long time.

Same here. They make one hell of a comic book team-up.

-----------------------

I have a question. On the letters page someone asked if Bruce was actually Damian's father. They said to look at Batman #676 for answers. I read that, but I can't remember exactly what went down (and with it being Morrison who wrote that odds are I never knew what happened :lol:). Is there any doubt about whether Bruce is his father? I really hope not, I've really come to love Damian, and I like that he's Bruce's son.[/quote]
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Mon Mar 14, 2011 3:29 pm

jaydee74 wrote:
Batman25JM wrote:Batman & Robin
Now this is what I'm talking about. This is exactly what I want in a Batman book. I haven't been the happiest person about Dick being Batman (I love him as Nightwing), but with Tomasi writing I just don't care. He nails Dick perfectly.

PoP quote of the year? ;)


:lol: You'll have to remember that come award time. :)

jaydee74 wrote:
Batman25JM wrote:Batman & Robin
There are so many great touches in this book. I love Dick being a good detective, and Damian's skills improving. I don't know if it was intentional, but I loved how Dick took off the cape and cowl when back at base. I don't know why, but it just felt like something Dick would do.

I think the touches in the interaction between Dick and Damian are simply outstanding. They have a good back and forth going on and I agree. Dick would take off the cape and cowl in the cave and you noticed that Damian kept it on? I liked tht.


Yeah, I noticed that. I too liked that. Just some great stuff in this issue.

jaydee74 wrote:
Batman25JM wrote:Batman & Robin
I really hope Tomasi and Gleason are on this book for a good long time.

Same here. They make one hell of a comic book team-up.


Completely agreed. They are awesome together.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:15 am

Is Gleason and Tomasi coming back to this book after their arc is over? It seems that the next story arc is being written by Judd Winnick and it will involve Jason Todd as Red Hood. Don't get me wrong. I like Winnick and I like Winnick writing Jason Todd but I hope this isn't a thing where every arch is done by a completely different creative team. I think after awhile that would just get kind of jarring. I hope Tomasi and Gleason are back on after the Winnick arc.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:54 pm

I'm not sure. Honestly, I'm thrilled that Winick will be back on a Bat-book and writing Red Hood. I'm a HUGE Winick fan. However, I'm loving Tomasi and Gleason's run so far (and Tomasi is also a favorite writer of mine). I have to assume that they'll be back after Winick's arc. I don't think they'd put Tomasi and Gleason on the book for just one arc.

Like I said, I'm happy that Winick will be writing a Bat book again, but I'm really mad that Red Hood is wearing that damn button helmet on the covers of the book. I HATE that. I was hoping the stuff that Morrison did would just be ignored. I would so love it if Winick was put on another Batman book. He should return to the main Batman book.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:32 am

I like Winnick's stuff. I don't love it. He's kind of hit or miss with me on certain things but when he's on and he's writing certain characters, I totally get behind it and he's got Jason down like very few others do. I don't mind the helmet as much but maybe it's just for the covers. You never know. We'll see but so far this is the third creative change since Morrison left the book and it's giving me a bad feeling overall. I do hope Tomasi and Gleason are back after the Winnick arc and I hope that they are the permanent creative team on the book going forward. Still, I'll be interested in seeing what Winnick brings to Batman and Robin.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:42 am

Batman & Robin #22
What an amazing end to this story arc. Tomasi and Gleason are such a dynamic duo and they bring the dynamic duo of Dick Grayson and Damian a whole lot of amazing stuff. I love the interactions between Dick, Damian and Alfred. Tomasi hits the nail on the head when it comes to the characterizations and I simply love it. The motive behind this arc while maybe a bit cliche is done very nicely and I hope he is used again sometime down the line.

I have to say Winnick and whoever the artist is will really need to step up their game having to do a story after this amazing story arc and nothing against Winnick but I do hope we get Tomasi and Gleason back on the book when the Red Hood arc is done and I want that for two reasons. #1. I want there to finally be a stable creative team. No more changing up the creative teams after each arc. #2. Tomasi and Gleason just work great together on this book and it's really amazing what the two of them can do.

Looking forward to the next issue even though it's not done by Tomasi and Gleason.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby LOOSECANNON » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:50 pm

Pretty good. I like this team. It's nothing out of the extraordinary but consistency matters. You have to remembe this team is hard at work on both War of the Green Lanters and Brightest Day so having Winnick come in for an arc allows them to do both.

Some of the one-liners from Damien were great and Grayson is becoming Batman more and more. I really don't see him going back (to Nightwing).
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Thu Apr 14, 2011 3:02 pm

I didn't really think about that but the Green Lantern stuff is probably keeping them busy. I do love the dynamic between Dick and Damian and I think Dick Grayson has really become Batman to me. I think at this point going back to Nightwing is almost a step down. I really liked this issue and cannot wait for more from this creative team on this title.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby LOOSECANNON » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:57 am

If Dick Grayson hands back the Bat mantle, Didio should be fired.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Sat Apr 16, 2011 12:28 am

Batman & Robin #22

Awesomeness. Tomasi and Gleason kick ass! I think Gleason now draws my favorite Damian.

----------------------------

When I read Tomasi's B&R or Snyder's Detective Comics I like Dick as Batman a lot, but I still want him to go back to being Nightwing at some point. I still don't like the idea of two Batmen (more if you count all the Batman, Inc. stuff). I really don't think Dick going back to being Nightwing would be a step down. It's not like Batman is a rank that you attain. Going back to being Nightwing wouldn't be a demotion, it would be him going back to who he is. I fully believe that Nightwing is who Dick is. He created that identity for himself, and I think he should go back to it after Batman, Inc.'s downfall.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Mon Apr 18, 2011 7:45 am

I like him too much as Batman to be honest. I think he's taken the role of Batman and made it his own in the same way he made Nightwing his own and I do think that going back to Nightwing would be a step down. Being Batman isn't a rank in the traditional sense of the word but there is a status and hierarchy that comes with wearing the mantle of the Bat. The Batman name carries a lot more weight than the Nightwing name no matter what Dick does in the Nightwing costume, it will never be in the same league as the Batman legacy.

When you look at the DC Universe, it's all about legacies. You have two Wildcats, three Flashes, five humans who use the name Green Lantern plus an entire army of non-humans. Even if Bruce were to come back to Gotham and work the streets, I could see him and Dick still working the double Batman routine. I have always said that Bruce would be the night shift Batman. The Dark Knight who takes out crime from the shadows while Dick Grayson is the day shift Batman. He's the face of Gotham. The leader of the JLA. He's the Caped Crusader and it's interesting to have two different Batmen like that and I hope it doesn't change anytime in the near future.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Mon Apr 18, 2011 7:19 pm

jaydee74 wrote:I like him too much as Batman to be honest. I think he's taken the role of Batman and made it his own in the same way he made Nightwing his own and I do think that going back to Nightwing would be a step down. Being Batman isn't a rank in the traditional sense of the word but there is a status and hierarchy that comes with wearing the mantle of the Bat. The Batman name carries a lot more weight than the Nightwing name no matter what Dick does in the Nightwing costume, it will never be in the same league as the Batman legacy.

When you look at the DC Universe, it's all about legacies. You have two Wildcats, three Flashes, five humans who use the name Green Lantern plus an entire army of non-humans. Even if Bruce were to come back to Gotham and work the streets, I could see him and Dick still working the double Batman routine. I have always said that Bruce would be the night shift Batman. The Dark Knight who takes out crime from the shadows while Dick Grayson is the day shift Batman. He's the face of Gotham. The leader of the JLA. He's the Caped Crusader and it's interesting to have two different Batmen like that and I hope it doesn't change anytime in the near future.



I just don't think Dick's really done anything to make Batman his own. A lot of the stories with him as Batman seem like he's trying to be Bruce. A lot of it doesn't feel like him. I'm not going to say that that is the case in every appearance of him as Batman. It isn't. However, in Morrison's Batman & Robin and Daniel's Batman he seems/seemed more like Bruce than Dick. I feel like some of Dick has been swallowed up by the cape and cowl. Tomasi's Batman & Robin and Snyder's Detective Comics have done things to change this, but so far nothing major has happened in my eyes to really have Dick make Batman his own.

I do agree about the status afforded to Batman. However, I just feel like Batman is who Bruce is. It's more his identity than it is an identity that can just be passed around. Now, this is funny because I LOVE Batman Beyond, but for me that felt different.

I don't categorically disagree with much of what you said, I just think Dick is better suited as Nightwing.

I get that DC is a company of legacies, but Batman has never really had much to do with that. You have had numerous Flashes and GLs, but with Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman you've always had Bruce, Clark, and Diana respectively. Sure, others have filled in for them from time to time, but you've never had multiple Batmen (until now), Supermen, or Wonder Women running around. Maybe if they'd had multiple people using those identities in the past I'd be more welcome to this. I mean, I've always been used to there being a bunch of Flashes, GLs, and the like, but that's now how it's been with Batman before, and I'm not thrilled with that development.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:16 pm

We can agree to disagree but I truly feel that Dick has made the mantle of the Bat his own. He is still himself and people know it. Gordon has mentioned it. Damian has mentioned it and I'm sure there are others as well. Now a good part of it is because Dick has taken what he's learned from being Nightwing and in my opinion incorporated it with his Batman persona. Dick is still Dick as Batman. I do not see him as a Bruce copycat in anyway and as much as I liked Dick as Nightwing, I love him as Batman.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Dickgrayson007 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:01 pm

I can't wait for the next arc with Winnick, I love his take on Jason.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby Batman25JM » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:11 pm

^Same here. I'm greatly looking forward to Winick's arc. Though I'm not too thrilled with the fact that Guillem March is doing the art.
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Re: Batman & Robin

Postby jaydee74 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:26 pm

I'm not familiar with the artist but Winnick does the best Jason Todd. I'll be curious to see what happens in this arc.
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